CONAN THE BARBARIAN & CONAN THE DESTROYER - Intrada

[nadszyszkownik Kilkujadek]

No to już możemy doliczyć:
Pielucha 9 - 0 Adam

Jak w takim tempie będzie się 'moczył', to za to, co wyda na pampersy, to 100 Conanów by sobie kupił

[Adam]

Jak wychodził re-rec Adam walił takie same scoregasmy.. Teraz pisze że "po co kupowaliście" A potem jak będzie coś nie tak z wydaniami Intrady, to powie że "wiedziałem żeby re-recu nie sprzedać"

nie do końca.. ja wszystko co związane z conanem wciągam w ciemno jakby to był cdr to też bym połknął

[Turek]

Datę wydania tych Conanów obadajcie lepiej

[Adam]

skoro dopiero zaczęli prace to wcześniej niż za 3 msc nie ma co liczyć.
a ja ide o zakład że będzie po nowym roku na 30 lecie conana.

[Althazan]

Wg Rogera Barbarzyńca ma być tytułem MAF (bez limitu), ma się też pojawić wcześniej niż Niszczyciel (wg Fake'a).
Doug napisał też, że znaleźli wczesne wersje osobnych linii melodycznych w różnych konfiguracjach - zapowiada się sporo alternatów Roger pisze, że Basil nie był faktycznie zadowolony z wykonania, ale właściwie dotyczy to raczej Niszczyciela, ale spróbują zedytować istniejące nagrania tak, by wypełnić jego wolę Zwłaszcza Main Title to może być wyzwanie... Z Barbarzyńcą wg Rogera nie ma żadnego problemu - niezadowolenie Basila wynikało z jego perfekcjonizmu (np. próbował ponad 100 fortepianów, zanim wybrał ten jeden do wykonania "It's My Party" ). W Barbarzyńcy Włosi grali tak długo, aż poszczególne linie były takie jak trzeba...
Cały tekst:

I'm working on both scores at the same time but CONAN THE BARBARIAN will hit before DESTROYER. Big surprise. If there's any one thing that stands out it's just the sheer power and energy captured in these originals that just raises the few hairs I have left on the back of my neck!

I recall talking at length to Basil about the first score while we were mastering our very first release, which was RED DAWN. One of the things he stated was how disappointed he was that the film ended up being mixed just for mono presentations. He said one reel had been mixed in Dolby surround for testing and the producers decided not to incur the extra costs. Basil was really frustrated because he said he'd managed to capture such ferocious "over the top" performances on the multi-channel session masters and couldn't understand why the film makers would reduce it all down into a mono film soundtrack.

The two-track mixes were used for the record versions (and the later Varese CDs) and everyone, including Basil, pointed out those actual original 24-track session masters were lost for ever. So it was a goosebump moment to find virtually everything alive and well in those Universal vaults.

Since these are the unedited masters being heard for the first time, we're having a blast finding out all sorts of cool stuff: Basil's very first take of the famous CONAN THE BARBARIAN main title ("Anvil Of Crom") has those familiar French horns starting out not low as they always have done BUT way up an octave, screaming in the upper register! He obviously didn't like the high melody line and asked them to drop it an octave. And there's a complete bridge section recorded for the sequence after the "Funeral Pyre" scenes that has never been heard before, not even in the re-recording.

Some of the neatest things are finding out how much power Basil got out of his percussion by frequently having the tympani and bass drums try several different strokes and volume levels, making adjustments right there on the podium to get just the sound he wanted. Much of the energy comes from working right there and literally ad-libbing specific passages, then adding other percussion sounds and getting that unique Conan sound.

I honestly can't think of many film scores where the raw power and intensity comes from players who just "go for it". THE WIND AND THE LION, recorded in Germany, comes to mind. Anyway, as Roger pointed out, when we were doing JASON AND THE ARGONAUTS, Bruce Broughton and engineer Mike Ross pointed out just how raw energy and vitality would trump clinically accurate playing on epic scores like this. I know in my heart that's what Basil was looking for during his Conan sessions. Captured on 24-tracks spread out over two inch wide tape, I can hear those players giving Basil just what he wanted. And we're really excited about bringing it all to you.
--Doug

[Bucholc Krok]

Jak wychodził re-rec Adam walił takie same scoregasmy.. Teraz pisze że "po co kupowaliście" A potem jak będzie coś nie tak z wydaniami Intrady, to powie że "wiedziałem żeby re-recu nie sprzedać"

Hehe..

Jak w takim tempie będzie się 'moczył', to za to, co wyda na pampersy, to 100 Conanów by sobie kupił

Ostatnio trochę grosza zebrał.

Wg Rogera Barbarzyńca ma być tytułem MAF (bez llimitu)

No to śpimy spokojnie. Nie ma obawy, że spieprzą z nakładem.

[Turek]

Ja chcę datę wydania... A wiecie że ostatnio walczę z nałogiem ? Nie słucham Conana od 10 lipca Ani jednego utworu. Już niemal miesiąc Uznałem że jak wrócę do niego po dłuższym czasie to dopiero będzie smakować Ale podejrzewam że stanie się to w sobotę, wrzucę re-reca do odtwarzacza, Sennheisery na uszy i noc w Cymerii O tak !

[Bucholc Krok]

Ja tam nie słuchałem chyba od roku, a całości to nie pamiętam kiedy.

[muaddib_dw]

Jak wychodził re-rec Adam walił takie same scoregasmy.. Teraz pisze że "po co kupowaliście" A potem jak będzie coś nie tak z wydaniami Intrady, to powie że "wiedziałem żeby re-recu nie sprzedać"

nie do końca.. ja wszystko co związane z conanem wciągam w ciemno jakby to był cdr to też bym połknął

Czyli nowego Conana też

[Mefisto]

Uznałem że jak wrócę do niego po dłuższym czasie to dopiero będzie smakować

A tu się okaże, że płyta nie działa, albo zaginęła

Ale fajnie, że drugą część też wydają. Co dalej? Red Sonja?

[Bucholc Krok]

Dobry, zły i brzydki.

[Adam]

Czyli nowego Conana też

w tym roku nowości kupiłem mało bo mało spełniało moje muzyczne gusta. jak nowy Conan będzie brzmiał np jak Thor czy Fast Five to wiadomo że kupię

[Adam]

i kolejne infa:

Here's an important item I'm literally just now working with... and you're welcome to chime in with your preferences. You may not get what you want, but maybe it'll help me make my choice. Please stick to the topic as I'm really curious about your responses to my question.

The first two cues in CONAN THE BARBARIAN are segued together in the movie, then the next three are combined into one giant piece in the picture as well. Poledouris dropped his opening prologue from the U.S. album and started right off with the "Anvil Of Crom". We'll include the opening prologue before the credits because it sounds so cool going from bass drum hits and light percussion suddenly to massive tympani and orchestra for the titles... but it's the next three cues that I'm curious about. Yes, we're including them, of course. But... as one large sequence as heard in the film - and intended by Poledouris - or as three separate cues like the album - and intended by Poledouris. (This is not a contradiction, by the way.)

Poledouris literally composed the segues (or crossfades) right into "Gift Of Fury", "Riders Of Doom" and "Wheel Of Pain" by ensuring the closing bars of each matched the opening bars of the following and whatnot. In the film it works beautifully and if assembled as such on the album for the first time it'll have a powerful effect. It was designed to work that way so it's not just good fortune.

However... Poledouris wanted to keep each of these parts separate on his album - and he did. And each cue works by itself as well. And, yes, the re-recording retains that sequence.

It's not practical or economically sensible to have all of these cues appear twice on our release, just to play it both ways (though I've thought about it) so...

Do you think you'd prefer the film assembly (which is quite dramatic when played as one lengthy cue) or the album assembly (which retains a degree of individual clarity not possible with the film assembly). Remember, Poledouris wanted it both ways... and got what he wanted with a movie and a record. We have to make a choice.
--Doug

[Adam]

i kolejne newsy:

Lots of fabulous responses here... and enough questions to fill those oceans that drank Atlantis! Here're a few answers that may satisfy.

The original MCA albums to both movies are true OSTs. They're not re-recordings. Both albums used cues from the actual soundtrack sessions, selected by Poledouris and his engineers as representative of the highlights and mixed down for release. Since we have the actual 24-track session elements, we're able to newly remix everything and allow solo lines and other colors to exhibit more clarity than possible back in the two-track stereo mixes made in '82 and '84 respectively.

Both albums used those original two-track mixes. The Varese CD to CONAN THE BARBARIAN was expanded solely because Poledouris had retained some additional cues on his own 1/4" 15 ips copy. Having been scored in Italy, there were no AFM restrictions on inclusion of the extra cues on a CD. But that expansion was limited to the handful of extra cues Poledouris retained, and the audio was necessarily limited to the two-track mixes.

We have a significant amount of alternate and rehearsal material, some interesting, some not. What makes portions interesting are the ones such as the main titles (Anvil Of Crom), where Poledouris starts with his French horns up an octave, then discards the idea after the first take. Hearing stuff like that from gestation into what we know and love is actually quite exhilarating. Listening to him develop the scraping sound of the tam tams or whatever for later takes of his "Wheel Of Pain" sequence is also of significance. Much of this score is a progression not of literal notes played as written but of creating sounds, percussion colors and whatnot right there as composer and musicians combine to create genuine primal energy, all fortunately while those 2" tape reels are spinning. (And how wonderful all those reels survived over the decades intact!)

Anyway, whether including this work-in-progress stuff becomes a matter of economics, of course. These are important film scores - the first one certainly one of the greatest ever - and one could easily end up with a massive box set chronicling the history of this incredible music, from the rehearsals and first takes to the tweaks and changes that ultimately created this genuinely powerful music. Maybe I'm a masochist, but for me, hearing Basil ask his bass drum and tympani players to try several different patterns until he gets just what he's looking for is fascinating. But, big surprise, every additional tidbit that might be fun also has licensing and mechanical fees - of course. What would the world be without fees.

Lots of wild info gets tossed around with projects anxiously sought such as this. For the record, Poledouris told me he was excited about the raw energy he got with the recordings, and how crisp the actual sound was. His disappointment came largely from the budgeting that wouldn't allow any multi-channel sound mixes, requiring what he called "rough" two-track mixes for the records and mono mixes for the movies themselves.

I gets lots of emails asking whether I prefer the "originals" or the "re-recording(s)". The quick answer is that both serve a wornderful function. The latter allows one to examine under a microscope years later the printed music as edited and polished, the former allows one to hear the raw emotional power of that same stuff actually being created. For specifics, however, in previously unreleased cues such as the "Pit Fights", I prefer the incredible savagery and piercing brass performances of the original to the clinical playing of the re-recording anyday. And nothing beats that original recording of those pounding percussion rhythms, followed by the unison French horn players literally being unleashed. Nothing. (But that's me.)

Oh, and for those multi-channel CD enthusiasts (which appear to number less than 7), we are most assuredly keeping the separate 24-track session masters intact, should anyone ever convince me that sales of 5.1 CDs would warrant such expenses.

As a post-scriptum, it's certainly exciting to find the new Blu-ray release of CONAN THE BARBARIAN taking advantage of the 5.1 audio at long last. And the music gets favored in the mix, too. Bravo! Basil's legacy is at work!
--Doug







Fantastic feedback fellow music lovers, Conan fans, soundtrack fans... whatever. I appreciate it a lot! Of course, just as Roger suggested to me a couple of nights ago, I'll no doubt be right back where I started. People will want it both ways. And he's right. Us humans are a crazy breed, aren't we?

Some points to keep in mind:

1) We NEVER simply place "2-second" spreads between tracks. NEVER. Did I say NEVER? I'll say it again. NEVER! When we master our albums, we always pay attention to the tempos, moods and pacing of the outgoing tracks as well as the incoming ones. Some massive action cues or long sobering sequences may need several seconds of pause before plunging into the next track. Other times, a long sobering sequence might instead be best followed by little pause and a sudden, immediate "wake up" call. Love themes may need a moment to savor the last lingering chords, short cues may work best with very brief one-second pauses... there is NO "one size fits all" approach here at Intrada. We make music. Other labels may do "global" pauses but we just can't. It's not musical. We started paying attention to pauses or "spreads" back with our first LP 25 years ago... interestingly (or coincidentally) with Poledouris. (Horner loves long pauses so one can absorb what they just heard, Phillips loves quick pauses so things'll keep moving right along.) Anyway, from the beginning we conducted beats during pauses, made tempo indications, tapped our feet, you name it to determine the gaps between tracks... and we still do so to this day. Always have, always will.

2) We won't be including Mako's narration... even as an "extra". He's on the movie. We're doing the music. Besides, to be honest, if I included favorite lines of dialog (besides owing a fortune to Universal) I'd have a 129-minute project. I'm a fan of the entire script.

3) My leaning is to present the three cues in question as three separate cues in the main program. I'm tempted to assemble them into one sequence as an extra on CD 2 so we have it both ways... if it's financially feasible. But separate tracks will probably trump crossfading them together, otherwise. Probably. Not yet positive.

I know some people would love lots of extras. We'll do what we can but offering the cues both assembled as in the movie and separated as on the LP, plus alternates, changes made during the sessions, versions with and without chorus and so forth just isn't possible. Remember, this is a long score and requires a second CD even without any extras. And... big surprise, though they may seem like mere bonuses, we actually pay for them. I'd like to keep this set affordable for people.

Nick Redman, an authority on John Milius and a friend of Basil's, is writing our liner notes. If there are interesting nuggets to be had from Milius regarding the situation, Nick will probably unearth them. But it's entirely possible that Morricone was merely considered for the project and nothing more. Still, it's fun to see the (sort of) "third" Conan movie getting scored by that same Morricone.

We're working as quickly as we can on this. Just remember that we're working on a lot of projects simultaneously so our plates are really full. I know I've said this before, but we wouldn't have it any other way around here. We love this stuff.
--Doug

[Turek]

WHEN ??????????